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 Post subject: Grenadier Regiment 5
PostPosted: Fri Jul 29, 2016 4:03 pm 
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I will start Grenadier Regiment 5
The regiment was raised in 1689
Garrison city was Danzig in East Prussia
they were part of the XVII A K
Konig Friedrich I
The special collar and cuffs were given
to the regiment 16.6. 1913
If I understand what Jan K. Kube wrote
these collar and cuffs were patterned
after the old Regt von Diericke No. 16
( Glenn if you read this please check me )

The cypher was given to the shoulder straps
and epaulettes 27.1. 1889

The helmet plate was changed to the "new "
wide winged Grenadier eagle 16.6. 1913

Here is a very rare officers Waffenrock for G R 5
due to fact they only received the special collar
and cuffs 16.6. 1913 , the blue pre-war
could have been worn for a short time .
This tunic has no bridle loops for the
epaulettes . It is display with the shoulder straps .
Just a guess is that it was so an issue
maybe they would no longer wear the epaulettes ?

Image

collar and cuff detail
a small moth on the blue piping of the cuff
Blue piping is correct for G R 5

Image

Image

A nice late issue Grenadier officers helmet .
I have no way of knowing which regiment
could be from any of 7 regiments that did
not have a special helmet .
But since it is a late issue , it makes a
nice display with G R 5 .
Steve

Image


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 Post subject: Re: Grenadier Regiment 5
PostPosted: Fri Jul 29, 2016 4:27 pm 
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Steve,

Quote:
If I understand what Jan K. Kube wrote
these collar and cuffs were patterned
after the old Regt von Diericke No. 16
( Glenn if you read this please check me )



Absolutely right. This from the regimental history of GR 5:

Regards
Glenn

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 Post subject: Re: Grenadier Regiment 5
PostPosted: Fri Jul 29, 2016 5:18 pm 
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Glenn ;
Super information as always .
Many Thanks !
Great post by you .
Sometime you will have to email me
just which history that is .
I have one on G R 5
but it does not cover that information .
It would be interesting to know what other old
regiments the special collar and cuffs were drawn from.
G R 1 ; G R 2 ; G R 3 ;G R 4 ; G R 7 and L G R 8
You are the man !

Steve


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 Post subject: Re: Grenadier Regiment 5
PostPosted: Fri Jul 29, 2016 5:39 pm 
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The old I R No. 16 was stationed in Danzig
1806-1807 and they were allowed to join
the Konig Friedrich I ( 4th East Prussian )
Grenadier Regiment No. 5 in 1808
Col. Otto Friedrich von Diericke was the
I R No. 16 Commander in 1799
He later became a Major General

After I saw the pattern of the flag of the old
I R No. 16 , it is my opinion that when Kaiser Wilhelm II
awarded the new flags to G R 5 , they were patterned
after the old I R No. 16 flags
Batls I ; II and the Fusilier Batls got their new flags in 1900
IV Batl got their new flag in 1894
show here is the G R 5 pattern flag of 1900
maybe I Batl
over the years one flaming grenade is missing on the right side


Image

This is the Sakular Parade Banner as worn on the flag of G R 5
for Batls I ; II and Fusilier . 1689 1789 1889 the regiment was
standing for 200 years in 1889 . On the left arm of the Banner
is the crown and monogram of Konig Friedrich III
on the right arm the crown and monogram of Kaiser Wilhelm II

Image

Sakular Parade Banner G R 5 / IV Batl
Steve

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 Post subject: Re: Grenadier Regiment 5
PostPosted: Fri Jul 29, 2016 5:45 pm 
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If anyone wants to see other photos
of the officers late issue helmet
I will get it out and remove the spike
and chin straps and shoot photos
Steve


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 Post subject: Re: Grenadier Regiment 5
PostPosted: Fri Jul 29, 2016 6:07 pm 
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Great stuff you got there and lots of information to

Nice one =D>

Jonas


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 Post subject: Re: Grenadier Regiment 5
PostPosted: Fri Jul 29, 2016 7:33 pm 
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KAGGR#1 wrote:
Glenn ;
Super information as always .
Many Thanks !
Great post by you .
Sometime you will have to email me
just which history that is .
I have one on G R 5
but it does not cover that information .
It would be interesting to know what other old
regiments the special collar and cuffs were drawn from.
G R 1 ; G R 2 ; G R 3 ;G R 4 ; G R 7 and L G R 8
You are the man !

Steve


According to Martin Lezius, Das Ehrenkleid des Soldaten (Berlin, 1938), the source of the embroidery patterns is:

Grenadier Regt. 1 from Regt. von Kanitz

Grenadier Regt. 2 from Regt. von Ruits

Grenadier Regt. 8 from Regt. von Itzenplitz

Grenadier Regt. 7 from Regt. von Courbiere

Another source confirms the above and adds:

Grenadier Regt. 3 from Regt. von Buelow:

One must be careful, as I believe infantry regiments under Frederick the Great were often just given the name of their commander, which obviously changed from time to time. I could do some further research on the subject, but i don't know if anyone besides you and me is interested.


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 Post subject: Re: Grenadier Regiment 5
PostPosted: Fri Jul 29, 2016 8:00 pm 
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Pallasch ;
Many thanks
That is great information
I would hope more interest than you & I
but anyway if you can find more information
I would sure like to have it .
With what you have provided
the only regiment missing is G R 4

G R 6 and G R 11 had gold bullion litzen
so I don't know about these two .
I have never seen a G R 6 officers Waffenrock
it is 1 of 3 that I am missing ; G R 3 ; 6 and 9
I have a beauty of G R 11 that I bought from Jan K. Kube
some years ago . When I get around to G R 11
I will post photos
Thanks
Steve


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 Post subject: Re: Grenadier Regiment 5
PostPosted: Fri Jul 29, 2016 10:40 pm 
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KAGGR#1 wrote:
Pallasch ;
Many thanks
That is great information
I would hope more interest than you & I
but anyway if you can find more information
I would sure like to have it .
With what you have provided
the only regiment missing is G R 4

Steve


It took me a bit of research, but Grenadier Regiment 4 was the successor of the old Prussian Infantry Regt. 14 (founded 1626) under Frederick the Great. The GR 4 embroidery pattern was clearly taken from that used by that regiment. It had various commanders during the reign of Frederick the Great, but in 1782 it was Graf Henckel v. Donnersmarck.


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 Post subject: Re: Grenadier Regiment 5
PostPosted: Sat Jul 30, 2016 10:57 am 
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Robert ;
Great information .
I will add this to G R 4 section
and credit you .
Also the flag of G R 4 seems to
be patterned after the flag of
the old Infantry Regt No. 14
Regiment on Foot .
I am now pretty sure when
the "new " Grenadier flags were
issued to each regiment
they were patterned after the old Infantry flags
Thanks
Steve


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 Post subject: Re: Grenadier Regiment 5
PostPosted: Sat Jul 30, 2016 2:27 pm 
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Chaps,

The "Stammregiment" of GR 4 was ultimately known under the name of it's last Chef, General-Major Gottlieb Ehrenreich v. Besser as Regiment Besser. (Nr. 14).

Regards
Glenn


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 Post subject: Re: Grenadier Regiment 5
PostPosted: Sat Jul 30, 2016 2:57 pm 
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Glenn ;
Many thanks
Yes, it appears that the last regiment commander
was von Besser in 1803
Thanks
Steve


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 Post subject: Re: Grenadier Regiment 5
PostPosted: Sat Jul 30, 2016 3:02 pm 
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A Fahnentrager display for Grenadier Regt. 5
I find the enlisted men's uniforms for the
Grenadier Regiments 1 thru 12 difficult to
find . In 46 years I have been able to locate
only three of them .
A nice line Grenadier helmet with the display
not unit marked
again the proper blue piping on the cuffs .
While the officers wore their special
collar and cuffs , the enlisted men
wore the litzen as shown here on
their collar and cuffs
Steve

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 Post subject: Re: Grenadier Regiment 5
PostPosted: Sun Jul 31, 2016 4:34 am 
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Fantastic sets thanks for sharing :thumb up:


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 Post subject: Re: Grenadier Regiment 5
PostPosted: Tue Aug 02, 2016 10:04 pm 
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Excellent, thanks for sharing.


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 Post subject: Re: Grenadier Regiment 5
PostPosted: Wed Aug 03, 2016 4:23 pm 
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To finish up the G R 5 group , some epaulettes
and shoulder straps . The last pair is a full Col.
the regiment Commander .
Steve

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Image

Image

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 Post subject: Re: Grenadier Regiment 5
PostPosted: Wed Aug 03, 2016 7:38 pm 
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Killing me, great stuff guy's.

James

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 Post subject: Re: Grenadier Regiment 5
PostPosted: Thu Aug 04, 2016 1:39 am 
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James ;
Thanks
Nice comments make the postings
worth doing .
I will pick up with G R 6 next
as time allows . Not a lot for G R 6
but G R 7 and L G R 8 will pick up
Thanks
Steve


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 Post subject: Re: Grenadier Regiment 5
PostPosted: Thu Aug 04, 2016 9:59 am 
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Steve your collection in awesome =D>

James

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